Comments on: Web Developers – We Don’t Need No Education? http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/ From one geek to many others... Sat, 13 Mar 2010 11:00:40 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Chris http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2621 Chris Fri, 31 Oct 2008 13:02:44 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2621 I agree with Vince. I feel that we are in a market saturated with averages and lacking the exceptional. You can hardly throw a Google without hitting 27 [friend's cousins] who promise the world and end up delivering a rusty bucket full of exceptions. I have no qualifications in my field, but have always wanted to get them. Sadly full-time work and a family preclude this, so I'll have to settle for an exceptional job and the contentment I derive from it. I agree with Vince. I feel that we are in a market saturated with averages and lacking the exceptional. You can hardly throw a Google without hitting 27 [friend's cousins] who promise the world and end up delivering a rusty bucket full of exceptions.

I have no qualifications in my field, but have always wanted to get them. Sadly full-time work and a family preclude this, so I’ll have to settle for an exceptional job and the contentment I derive from it.

]]> By: Andrew Cairns http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2434 Andrew Cairns Mon, 06 Oct 2008 13:40:02 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2434 I recently graduated with a degree in Web Design and Development. Between 3rd and 4th year - there was a huge discussion between the class if continuing into 4th year was worth the qualification over the work experience you can get during that year. I myself stayed on, found the year very rewarding and have taken the initiative to take a Post-Graduate focusing on Business Startup Incubation. Looking back, the people that left to get a "head-start" on the industry has accomplished less than I have working part-time at a local agency... I thought I would share this... was an entertaining read as the Zend Certification subject was risen a few times during our discussions. I recently graduated with a degree in Web Design and Development. Between 3rd and 4th year – there was a huge discussion between the class if continuing into 4th year was worth the qualification over the work experience you can get during that year.

I myself stayed on, found the year very rewarding and have taken the initiative to take a Post-Graduate focusing on Business Startup Incubation.

Looking back, the people that left to get a “head-start” on the industry has accomplished less than I have working part-time at a local agency…

I thought I would share this… was an entertaining read as the Zend Certification subject was risen a few times during our discussions.

]]> By: Links, Links and Links - Know more about the Test | Zend PHP 5 Certification Blog http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2405 Links, Links and Links - Know more about the Test | Zend PHP 5 Certification Blog Thu, 02 Oct 2008 12:18:05 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2405 [...] about the Zend PHP5 Certification: Web Developers - We Don’t Need No Education? All About ZCE Preparing for Zend PHP5 Certification Preparing for the Zend Certification About the [...] [...] about the Zend PHP5 Certification: Web Developers – We Don’t Need No Education? All About ZCE Preparing for Zend PHP5 Certification Preparing for the Zend Certification About the [...]

]]> By: Michael Riley http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2305 Michael Riley Wed, 24 Sep 2008 01:47:22 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2305 I have to agree with you for the most part, but I also think you have to take the attitude that a degree isn't a requisite for being a good developer with a grain of salt. I've been doing various web related jobs for several years now, and have just started out running my own shop with a few small contracts. I'll give you the low down from a different perspective: someone who is hiring a web developer. From my point of view, I'm looking for people who can: 1. meet deadlines 2. communicate effectively 3. work efficiently 4. learn a new language within a week or so You can't really show any qualitative evidence of these skills just by building a portfolio, although interviewing well does help a lot. But on that same topic, interviewing well is a skill that can be aided by a traditional academic education! I'll admit though, many of the most skilled people I've ever worked with have no college degree, but it sure is damn helpful when you're trying to convey your non-technical abilities. I have to agree with you for the most part, but I also think you have to take the attitude that a degree isn’t a requisite for being a good developer with a grain of salt. I’ve been doing various web related jobs for several years now, and have just started out running my own shop with a few small contracts. I’ll give you the low down from a different perspective: someone who is hiring a web developer.

From my point of view, I’m looking for people who can:

1. meet deadlines
2. communicate effectively
3. work efficiently
4. learn a new language within a week or so

You can’t really show any qualitative evidence of these skills just by building a portfolio, although interviewing well does help a lot. But on that same topic, interviewing well is a skill that can be aided by a traditional academic education!

I’ll admit though, many of the most skilled people I’ve ever worked with have no college degree, but it sure is damn helpful when you’re trying to convey your non-technical abilities.

]]> By: Certified or not, that is the question | CodeRumor http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2298 Certified or not, that is the question | CodeRumor Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:25:55 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2298 [...] framework, has a lot to say on this one. Hi’s arguments certainly are valid. Here’s a link to his [...] [...] framework, has a lot to say on this one. Hi’s arguments certainly are valid. Here’s a link to his [...]

]]> By: roj http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2297 roj Tue, 16 Sep 2008 23:45:52 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2297 After developing knowledge through books, sites and charity work I thought I'd take the web apps course with the open university. It's only a cert and not a degree but with no prior formal education in this field thought it might be a good step. I've learnt a bit but not sure if my efforts wouldn't have been better spent continuing with the informal route as a fair bit of the content has been outdated or very brief. After developing knowledge through books, sites and charity work I thought I’d take the web apps course with the open university. It’s only a cert and not a degree but with no prior formal education in this field thought it might be a good step. I’ve learnt a bit but not sure if my efforts wouldn’t have been better spent continuing with the informal route as a fair bit of the content has been outdated or very brief.

]]> By: Vince Stross http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2296 Vince Stross Mon, 15 Sep 2008 17:25:38 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2296 I've been in the IT field for 8 years now, bringing home more per year than I would have spent on a degree. If you're talented, then you'll do well. i often find when i talk to someone who "can't find work" in this field, it's because they thought their degree would find it for them. it's always <em>who</em> you know that puts you in the position to show <em>what</em> you know. or, when I really try to "talk shop" they don't know anything. which is either because they've never had a real project to work on, or they just don't have the passion for it; for them it was all about the promise of high salaries. you can't be too proud to take on some pro-Bono projects to build the portfolio and experience. people don't do this unless they love to code. anyone can get a job. but you have to love what you do to snag a good one. no piece of paper can give that to you. you can learn more from a $60 book than an outdated professor anyway. I’ve been in the IT field for 8 years now, bringing home more per year than I would have spent on a degree.

If you’re talented, then you’ll do well. i often find when i talk to someone who “can’t find work” in this field, it’s because they thought their degree would find it for them. it’s always who you know that puts you in the position to show what you know. or, when I really try to “talk shop” they don’t know anything. which is either because they’ve never had a real project to work on, or they just don’t have the passion for it; for them it was all about the promise of high salaries.

you can’t be too proud to take on some pro-Bono projects to build the portfolio and experience. people don’t do this unless they love to code.

anyone can get a job. but you have to love what you do to snag a good one. no piece of paper can give that to you.

you can learn more from a $60 book than an outdated professor anyway.

]]> By: Jakob Buis http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2292 Jakob Buis Sun, 14 Sep 2008 20:48:18 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2292 Hmmm..."BSc in Web Application Development" sounds great. Though, I doubt that you could fill 3 full-time years with interesting courses when the only subjects are 'all things web'. Specialization is great, but I think "BSc in Web Application Development" is too much; but hey: that's what minors are for! If my university offered a minor in web-science I'll be the first to attend. Hmmm…”BSc in Web Application Development” sounds great. Though, I doubt that you could fill 3 full-time years with interesting courses when the only subjects are ‘all things web’.

Specialization is great, but I think “BSc in Web Application Development” is too much; but hey: that’s what minors are for!

If my university offered a minor in web-science I’ll be the first to attend.

]]> By: Scott Nelle http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2291 Scott Nelle Sun, 14 Sep 2008 20:21:25 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2291 I've got a Bachelor's degree in Web Site Development and Management, But no one else that I work with does. It's certainly nothing close to a requirement to work in our field. And honestly, I feel like I would have learned a lot more spending those 4 years working on the web. I have noticed, however, that a lot of the recent postings on the web job boards seem to list "Bachelor's degree in computer science or a related field" as a requirement. So I'm glad that I have the degree, but I certainly don't feel that I'm at any advantage over someone with a more general degree. If you are a young web worker being urged into college/university I think finding a web-specific program might be a good move, but only because it will offer courses close to your interests--not because it will give you a career advantage over your computer science peers. I’ve got a Bachelor’s degree in Web Site Development and Management, But no one else that I work with does. It’s certainly nothing close to a requirement to work in our field. And honestly, I feel like I would have learned a lot more spending those 4 years working on the web. I have noticed, however, that a lot of the recent postings on the web job boards seem to list “Bachelor’s degree in computer science or a related field” as a requirement. So I’m glad that I have the degree, but I certainly don’t feel that I’m at any advantage over someone with a more general degree. If you are a young web worker being urged into college/university I think finding a web-specific program might be a good move, but only because it will offer courses close to your interests–not because it will give you a career advantage over your computer science peers.

]]> By: mihailt http://www.haughin.com/2008/09/14/web-development-qualifications/comment-page-1/#comment-2290 mihailt Sun, 14 Sep 2008 15:52:45 +0000 http://www.haughin.com/?p=157#comment-2290 Hi, great post, i think that if you would look on a certification side a bit wider you could find a lot more than ZCE, fo example look ar A+, mysql exams DBA or DBD, and there as well tons of exams on abobe or ms technologies, so with a certain approach in a couple of year you could have some widely know certificates. But as well i agree that, besides certification real experience needed and it cannot be replaced by anything else. Hi,
great post, i think that if you would look on a certification side a bit wider you could find a lot more than ZCE, fo example look ar A+, mysql exams DBA or DBD, and there as well tons of exams on abobe or ms technologies, so with a certain approach in a couple of year you could have some widely know certificates. But as well i agree that, besides certification real experience needed and it cannot be replaced by anything else.

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